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dobbs
MMR Director
Domestic Engineer
Malaysia
1265 Posts |
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UK Doc
Friendly member
United Kingdom
461 Posts |
 Posted - 24/04/2006 : 16:09:50
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If any of you needs some fresh air, here is a letter from another JPA scholar, something refreshing. (comment 1)
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He maketh me to lie in green pasture
https://greenpasture.wordpress.com/ |
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dobbs
MMR Director
Domestic Engineer
Malaysia
1265 Posts |
Posted - 24/04/2006 : 16:37:43
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| Thanks for sharing UKDoc. Olly's letter is indeed something I've been waiting to hear (through all 75 responses!) instead of whining, rationalizing, insults and of all things being called "spiteful" for stating facts that are not palatable to the readers. |
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olly
Just lurking
2 Posts |
Posted - 24/04/2006 : 19:03:57
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Whoa, that was a massive discussion bout yummy and her predicaments.. she's one brave person, i must say, if i were to elude the govn, i shan't be advertising it here..
but she really shouldn't worry, the govn will not be pursuing her i'm sure; its not worth
wasting time and more money; sending lawyers after ex-scholars who have settled here already; just let them pay back the money in installments, why not? its a win - win situation..and
puhleaze, instead of pouring money on overseas undergraduate med degree and risk a brain drain.. i wish the govn would spend money on helping more dedicated docs in msia specialize abroad (with contracts to return of course!), or investing it on deserving students in local med courses.
last year, the govn posted an annoucement that a 4 year grace period will be given to all JPA scholars; then just a few months later; after most of us happily went for interviews and got accepted for foundation jobs here, they changed their minds; saying that it doesn't apply to my graduating batch! haha... wat a joke...oh well..i'm not a saint; nor am i a fool, i've got a job offer too (wink wink, the money tht i can bring home after a year here, would be helpful!)
but i turned it down as soon as the govn gave a resounding NO to my appeal. (yes, i'm a law abiding citizen...sigh)
Others may have decided to elude the govn as long as possible to get a few years training here, but i do believe most will eventually return home if the govn demanded.. its just whether u're a risk taker; and what long term commitments you've developed abroad. Everyone has their own reasons which path they choose, this is just me , my choice. I Respect yummy for sincerely wanting to repay her bond..if i could repay it in installments, obviously i would have more say on my future, righto? However, its not my decision to make. I have no regrets wanting to go home, becoz whatever difficulties i may face; i'm fortunate to have a bunch of supportive friends and lovely family to complain and grumble to..:) p/s: and malaysian cuisine is a MAJOR factor too. haha..
BUT to risk getting my family and myself embroiled in legal issues is undesirable. thts just personal preference, not patriotism..! :)
No benefit lies in reprimanding a mature, adult who had not been given the chance to redeem herself. I always try to put myself in other ppl's shoes; and try to understand their way of thinking. It may help to rationalize things, becoz in a nutshell, all we want is to lead a lifestyle most suited to us; its just tht extra mile each of us is willing to take to achieve it.
for me, its just a simple fact tht i love msian life..prob related to the environment tht i was brought up in..i'm not disgruntled, having been marginalised by 'quotas' in many things in life, it just motivates me more to achieve further, and greater satisfaction when i do finally achieve it.. but i honestly hope tht msia will gradually veer out of that system, into a more transparent and efficient administration i pray. Msia's system would be a success one day, if it manages to give its citizens no reasons to migrate overseas, becoz i believe most would love to live at home in the end...
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Edited by - olly on 24/04/2006 19:11:17 |
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palmdoc
MMR CEO
Blogger
Malaysia
2033 Posts |
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palmdoc
MMR CEO
Blogger
Malaysia
2033 Posts |
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ngchmd
Verbose member
Malaysia
1981 Posts |
Posted - 25/04/2006 : 07:45:44
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>>Whoa, that was a massive discussion bout yummy and her predicaments.. she's one brave person, i must say, if i were to elude the govn, i shan't be advertising it here.. >>
Why?
One’s mood and behaviour are driven by one’s thinking. Yummy was honest and forthcoming. However, she was emotional and this may have made her said a few things which sounded rather unpalatable. I am sure she can resolve her problems personally.
>>last year, the govn posted an annoucement that a 4 year grace period will be given to all JPA scholars; then just a few months later; after most of us happily went for interviews and got accepted for foundation jobs here, they changed their minds; saying that it doesn't apply to my graduating batch! haha... wat a joke...oh well..i'm not a saint; nor am i a fool, i've got a job offer too (wink wink, the money tht i can bring home after a year here, would be helpful!)>>
With the recent highlights of this problem in the press, it is almost certain that this decision by the JPA was taken at the highest level of government. This must have upset our scholars.
(LF: Some scholars may feel aggrieved over this ruling. Other than expressing severe reservation or objection to the flip-flop policy which has inevitably affected their plan, what other good reasons can they offer for not fulfilling the terms of their contract?)
>>but i turned it down as soon as the govn gave a resounding NO to my appeal. (yes, i'm a law abiding citizen...sigh)>>
Yes, you comply or obey because the SITUATION has changed.
>>Others may have decided to elude the govn as long as possible to get a few years training here, but i do believe most will eventually return home if the govn demanded.. its just whether u're a risk taker; and what long term commitments you've developed abroad. Everyone has their own reasons which path they choose, this is just me , my choice.>>
The scholars are misled and confused. The terms of these scholarships were abused by previous scholars and therefore subsequent scholars followed likewise. Such behaviours by scholars to optimize their stay, income and training were predictable and encouraged by the laxity of enforcing the terms of the contract – the scholars cannot be solely blamed here.
>>I Respect yummy for sincerely wanting to repay her bond..if i could repay it in installments, obviously i would have more say on my future, righto?
The options: either repay the scholarship in one lump sum and freeing oneself from bondage or work in MOH for the next 10 years pocketing the 700000 (interest free).
It is difficult to save and build wealth in the early stages of one’s career. For a young person to be in huge debt for many years is not sensible. Unless one can pay the lump sum without incurring hardship for the next many years, it is wiser to choose the 2nd option. Ten years hence, with a young family and having completed the specialist training (assuming no dislocation), one is FREE. At the age of mid-30s (still young and prime), you can opt to continue in MOH, practice in the private sector (hopefully, still lucrative) or return to UK to restart one’s dream (if the fire is still burning). Delaying gratification is as much a strategy one can employ in life, for future long term happiness.
>>BUT to risk getting my family and myself embroiled in legal issues is undesirable. thts just personal preference, not patriotism..! :) >>
Yes, the impact on the guarantors has not been discussed. These poor chaps will be harassed and impoverished to pay back the full amount of the scholarship in a lump sum presumably. Is it fair for these guarantors who signed the contract out of love to be in this position?
>>No benefit lies in reprimanding a mature, adult who had not been given the chance to redeem herself. I always try to put myself in other ppl's shoes; and try to understand their way of thinking. It may help to rationalize things, becoz in a nutshell, all we want is to lead a lifestyle most suited to us; its just tht extra mile each of us is willing to take to achieve it.
for me, its just a simple fact tht i love msian life..prob related to the environment tht i was brought up in..i'm not disgruntled, having been marginalised by 'quotas' in many things in life, it just motivates me more to achieve further, and greater satisfaction when i do finally achieve it.. but i honestly hope tht msia will gradually veer out of that system, into a more transparent and efficient administration i pray. Msia's system would be a success one day, if it manages to give its citizens no reasons to migrate overseas, becoz i believe most would love to live at home in the end... >>
This level of moral reasoning to return home and fulfill the terms of the scholarship contract, though maybe pleasing, is not better than Yummy. (Sorry, my deduction) As for the dream of a better Malaysia, it is sadly true.
ngchmd |
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olly
Just lurking
2 Posts |
Posted - 25/04/2006 : 18:31:51
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| Haha, you're rite. i'm not very different from yummy, we're both normal, pragmatic adults, doing wat we think is best for ourselves and our families...unfortunately, I'm far from a scholar with high moral integrity. Was just expressing my real feelings. Sorry to say, I'm just your simple everyday malaysian fulfilling my responsibilities. No need for me to talk bout devotion to the country.. becoz action speaks louder than words ultimately. Even if i were to be given the choice of working in the UK, i'd only be tempted to work here for ONE foundation year, mainly becoz of the cash that i can save to bring back to msia in order to have a head start in monetary terms. I'm not trying to put moral reasonings behind going home, i'm just saying simply that ' hey, people, despite some shortcomings (as with any country) malaysia isn't perceived as such a bad place ; that most scholars want to RUN away from...most of us do love malaysian culture and its way of life...' I travelled with a friend abroad and showed her around malaysia last summer, and she absolutely loved it to bits, planning to migrate there one day too :). Living in the UK has made me realise how much cultural diversity and mutual tolerance we have at home, sometimes, we just need to remind ourselves of that. Being malaysians, We're brought up in a culture of hard work and dedication (compared to the lifestyle in UK, correct me if i'm wrong), doing our best with what we have; being grateful of what's been endowed upon us; and hopefully strive for better future for our next generations. |
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ngchmd
Verbose member
Malaysia
1981 Posts |
Posted - 26/04/2006 : 07:40:16
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I like YPs lucid arguments in her blog on this topic. It is also inevitable that her dissertation is focused on the moral reasoning and morality of these scholarship holders.
Scholar A chose to return. Scholar B chose to stay and defy. Their IQ, EQ and PQ (Practical intelligence), and moral reasoning determine their behaviour and the consequences. Their reasons and actions may be different, but the level of their moral reasoning is the same.
Moral decisions either based primarily on fear of punishment or the need to be obedient; and/or, is guided most by satisfying one’s interest, which may involve making bargains represent Kohlberg’s lowest level of moral reasoning.
Our scholars who are not fulfilling the terms of their scholarships willingly, can only be making decisions NOT based on Kohlberg’s intermediate or highest level of moral reasoning. I think this is situational; the awarding body is not without blame.
Olly, I am glad you voice your disagreement. Do not feel upset. I am no moral policeman, only self-opinionated and may often be wrong by a wide margin. Your parents, your family and your society can be proud of your achievement so far. Good luck and carve a great life ahead.
(P/S: Olly’s posting in UK Doc’s blog will be interpreted quite differently.)
ngchmd |
Edited by - ngchmd on 26/04/2006 07:44:54 |
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palmdoc
MMR CEO
Blogger
Malaysia
2033 Posts |
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ngchmd
Verbose member
Malaysia
1981 Posts |
Posted - 29/04/2006 : 08:13:28
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quote:
Originally posted by palmdoc
Also spotted YP's post On Returning Home
Interesting discussions going on in YP's blog.
Among the key points released in today's newspaper on The Wan Zahid Higher Education Report are:
Students to master at least two international languages.
Fewer undergraudate students but more postgraduates to study abroad.
100,000 PhD holders in 15 years.
World-class foreign university to "mentor" a local IPT.
Multi-tiered conditions for sponsorship.
ngchmd |
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yeepei
MMR Moderator
Scut Monkey
United Kingdom
730 Posts |
Posted - 29/04/2006 : 14:04:44
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quote:
Originally posted by ngchmd
quote:
Originally posted by palmdoc
Also spotted YP's post On Returning Home
Interesting discussions going on in YP's blog.
Thanks. :)
quote:
Students to master at least two international languages.
I don't understand the rationale behind this. To begin with, many students these days have problems communicating fluently in the English language, much less master it. (Unless of course English is also considered an international language.) Next, learning a new language is not easy, but to master it is taking it to a whole new level. I believe that unless you live in a society where you come into contact with the language on a regular basis, it is extremely difficult to be good at it.
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Am I making sense? No? Er.. Ah... Hmm... |
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ngchmd
Verbose member
Malaysia
1981 Posts |
Posted - 29/04/2006 : 16:02:54
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quote:
I don't understand the rationale behind this. To begin with, many students these days have problems communicating fluently in the English language, much less master it. (Unless of course English is also considered an international language.) Next, learning a new language is not easy, but to master it is taking it to a whole new level. I believe that unless you live in a society where you come into contact with the language on a regular basis, it is extremely difficult to be good at it.
You can read the full news here: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2006/4/29/nation/14105720&sec=nation
ngchmd |
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dobbs
MMR Director
Domestic Engineer
Malaysia
1265 Posts |
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rveerapen
Regular member
Canada
31 Posts |
Posted - 15/05/2006 : 04:50:36
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The PM sends Malaysians very confusing signals, mixing issues of ethics and morality [is it understandable or unpatriotic to remain abroad after training, huh??], with legality [breaking the scholarship contract].
How can future candidates take any scholarship contract seriously from now, pray tell me? |
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RM100 million down the drain
